Fingal wrote: ↑Fri Feb 19, 2021 3:06 pm
jmc wrote: ↑Fri Feb 19, 2021 11:09 am
The conspiracy by the governments in a whole bunch of countries to defer any way they can the day of reckoning for their utterly criminal behavior....
All lockdowns were politically motivated, there was zero actual science behind them.....
The cover up is the conspiracy. Thats about it.
There's a huge variety of responses by different governments. But to generalise horribly, some already-autocratic governments (eg China) used authoritarian methods to control the virus. It worked.
Other governments with a liberal reputation (eg NZ) also used strong methods such as lockdown, but not as strong as China. It worked.
A variety of other liberal governments in Europe tried the full gamut of responses from lockdown to 'herd immunity'. All of them failed to some degree.
And finally, you have a category of governments which although nominally democratic, were dominated by a populist figure (eg Bolsinaro and Trump). They went for a laissez faire response. It failed - badly.
You have an interesting definition of "worked". Mostly based on what you seem to have read in the MSM by the look of it.
First, none of the official government Chinese statistics are true. None. Just like in 2003 with SARs Cov 1. How can the lock-down have "worked" in China if there was a massive cover up of what actually happened. The various leaked official documents published in the ex-pat Chinese media tell a very different story of just what happened in China last year. And just how wide the official cover up has been. Exactly the same as in 2003. There have been several books that have document exactly what happened in 2003.
What happened in 2020 was a lot worse. The lock down in Hubei province only started when widespread political unrest and demonstrations started and the central government started to panic. Nothing to do with public health. The massive New Year migration a few weeks before was allowed to happen unhindered even though senior government officials knew exactly what was going on with SARs at the time.
Same goes for several other provinces. How many died in China? Try multiplying the low end IFR by 1.4 billion by around 15% general population infection rate for the first wave. Those are the numbers that started showing up in government ministry document by May last year. Which fits pretty closely the epidemic spread model published by Hong Kong Univ Med School guys in January 2020. The first guys to blow the whistle on the Chinese government cover-up.
Your understanding of what has happened in other countries is equally facile I am afraid. Bears little relation to what happened and why. The range of result in the US for example ranges from the catastrophic in NY, and NJ, terrible in CA and MA and not that bad in FL and TX. The laissez faire states did OK, the massive intervention and lock-down states have done very badly. To give just one example. Over 10% of all jobs in the Greater Los Angeles area are gone. Completely. The equivalent area of Florida is about 4%.
The governors of Texas and Florida who had the most laissez faire policies are among the most popular in the country. The Governor of Californian is being recalled and will probably be thrown out of office and as for the Governor of New York, with a bit of luck criminal charges will be filed against him pretty soon. His position is so bad even the Guardian is writing stories like this.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... sing-homes
So I stand by what I said originally - the conspiracy is the cover up of the criminal incompetent of the political leadership in a whole bunch of countries. In Europe the worst countries are Italy, Spain, Belgium, France, UK, Germany, and Ireland. With the Netherlands not far behind. The Nordics did pretty well as did Switzerland. And in the rest of the anglophone world Australia and NZ are completely bat sh*t crazy with Canada at the federal level not far behind.
Remember we are only in year one of what will be a three to five year event. Talking about "success" at this point is a futile as talking about winning a football match after 15 mins in the first half. The science is simple. Every country will end up sooner or later with the same kind of general infection rate for SARs CoV 2. Just like with Influenza. Some regional variations, but not much.
So it is just a matter of how long it takes individual countries to get there and how much self inflicted damage they do to themselves along the way. So far, for far too many countries, all the current indications of future policy are not very encouraging.