Vaccination

fon
Posts: 713
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2020 12:47 pm

Re: Vaccination

Post by fon »

RichardTechnik wrote: Mon Feb 15, 2021 4:22 pm Mirror approach to the lockdown fanatics anxious to create labels for all the non-righteous. Seems even handed to me
I'll just make a few independent observations, Richard; a mirror approach is not appropriate since lockdowns and vaccinations are completely orthogonal approaches to suppressing a virus. Either, both or neither can be tried, with varied results. There will be many lockdown zealots who renounce vaccination and vice versa in both directions.

Some data from Israel suggests vaccines are 94% effective at stopping infections. Few here would vouch for Lockdowns, but there are plenty of people elsewhere who do think lockdowns work, although it would be hard to quantify that in the same way vaccines can be quantified.

Support and antagonism for lockdowns and vaccination can also be orthogonal, one is able to support or renounce both independently. My personal view is that vaccination is safe and effective and that lockdowns do more harm than good. My views may be represented in some of my posts ; if you are an anti-vaxxer, you'll just have to suck that up, I'm afraid, but I wish you well whatever. I see vaccination as a way to reach herd immunity, making it politically possible to drop lockdown; I hope we have almost reached that point, as does the government.

I'll finish with one remark. We will soon be getting data on covid deaths of those vaccinated, versus those not vaccinated. Since we are reaching the end of the virus season, there are reasonable grounds to hope that the number of covid deaths of those vaccinated will be a very small cohort indeed compared to the total. If this is the case, it greatly diminishes the SAGE/government case for lockdown, since vaccination, not lockdown will be seen to be the primary effective measure.

thinksaboutit
Posts: 279
Joined: Wed Jan 06, 2021 11:38 am

Re: Vaccination

Post by thinksaboutit »

rms wrote: Mon Feb 15, 2021 10:23 am
`this forum, which is majority anti-vax,
Could you please quote your backup date on this assertion?
Have a look around this forum and see how many people are for and against vaccines. It stands out quite clearly.

fon
Posts: 713
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2020 12:47 pm

Re: Vaccination

Post by fon »

TruthClone wrote: Mon Feb 15, 2021 2:54 pm I am a fully paid up member of the tin-hat brigade and a full-on anti-vaxxer.
Science suggests the vaccine does some good for the elderly at least. Perhaps you should leave it until you are in a vulnerable group if you are not already, I hope lockdown doesn't last that long. How old are you iydmma?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-56068022

Pamela Stott
Posts: 41
Joined: Mon Aug 31, 2020 8:08 am

Re: Vaccination

Post by Pamela Stott »

First and foremost there is no covid 19 pandemic only a PCR test pandemic. . SO for me that answers the question.The government told you that the symptoms for most people are mild.So why is there a vaccine anyway?? And why the whole nation all of a sudden? Just a point to think about and I am doing that, having been approached via surgery and the state 5 times in their desperation to give me their EXPERIMENTAL Vaccine. This is not like the one people are generally familiar with which gives you a little bit of the disease and your body produces antibodies against this, in a hope that in the future if you come across the disease you will only have mild to moderate effects.A bit like getting covid in the first place , according to government. With regard to the EXPERIMENTAL vaccine this alters the genetic makeup of a cell (my understanding) to basically produce the immune response. However, if you fancy being a genetically modified human this might well be the road you are on. No-one actually knows how safe, whether safe, and what might happen in the future, not just after second dose, but into the long-distant future. That is why for me it absolutely will be a no, and to highlight the problems the statistics for deaths has risen sharply in the older age group since this vaccine was rolled out, but as autopsies are allowed to be wavered,now and the government also removed any liability for anyone dealing with manufactoure or promotion of vaccine if there were adverse affects suffered, and the final point, the tendering document showing the many advserse effects that are expected as shown in thehttps://ted.europa.eu/udl?uri=TED:NOTICE:506291-2020:TEXT:EN:HTML, then there are plenty reasons not to be partaking in this experiment. And one thing is for sure, any deaths since vaccine rollout of elderly people at least who show a positive PCR test will go down as a Covid death.Really!

misslawbore
Posts: 5
Joined: Sun Oct 04, 2020 6:04 pm

Re: Vaccination

Post by misslawbore »

I am very appreciative of ALL the wise informative and in one case even amusing replies. And thank you galacticwoman for the link to VAERS adverse vaccination events, it makes chilling reading.

The pressure is not always blatant (as it was from the GP), it can be subtle, in the form of virtue signalling. The worst reaction was “I don’t understand, why wouldn’t you have it?” In a hurt tone from a dear friend.

jjrock
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2020 9:49 pm

Re: Vaccination

Post by jjrock »

Hi, i would encourage anyone to take the vaccine who has a reasonable chance of geting seriously ill/dying from covid. Anyone else I am not sure it is worth the risk, and certainly would feel to me like paying someone who is blackmailing you.

I think a great argument for not having the vaccine is that you want the vulnerable groups (e.g. overweight 30 somethings with Type 2 DM) who actually might die from covid to get it first.

The whole "anti vax" concern is ridiculous - especially when you hear young people moaning about it - as it just means they will get their jab sooner.

If all the people who want the vaccine get it and there is still some problem - then JVT and the crew can start whining about it - but if there isn't a problem, then job done, everyone happy.

I also reckon a build up of natural immunity in the population will be far more helpful then vaccinated individuals as it is inevitable that the spike protein will mutate and a new vaccine needed, whilst the naturally immune will have a lot of cross immunity to all the parts of the virus.

bradw4
Posts: 61
Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2021 4:23 pm

Re: Vaccination

Post by bradw4 »

misslawbore wrote: Sat Feb 13, 2021 5:22 pm I am being pressured to have the vax from all sides: GP, relatives and friends. Please offer moral support
It's your body, your choice.

The left don't like it when you throw abortion slogans back at them. :D

fon
Posts: 713
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2020 12:47 pm

Re: Vaccination

Post by fon »

Pamela Stott wrote: Mon Feb 15, 2021 6:47 pm First and foremost there is no covid 19 pandemic, only a PCR test pandemic. .
Hi Pamela,

No, it's real, there have been an (unknown) percentage of cases that were not real, that is true, but there are many more which are real. Like you I needed to know for sure so I took the step of personally contacting Regius Chair of Medicine at the University of Oxford Sir John Bell, and used the fact that we are both Canadians to winckle a bit of truth out of him about the false positive problem.

He simply told me this: These are false positives that you can quantify as they are associated with high Ct values. The percentage of real positives has gone way up in some parts of the country. It has hit 4% in Liverpool. There is genuinely a problem

So that's it, Pamela, that's all he wrote.There genuinely is a problem. Once I'd spoken to John Bell, it set my mind at rest. I'm a retired senior scientist with many contacts in international Physics and Chemistry experiments. So I know how it goes.

So it is real, the pFizer boss , Mike Yeadon, stuck his neck out and even a big shot ex Pfizer drug discovery guy sometimes makes the wrong call. He's gone very quiet now, since he and Clare Craig spent a lot of credit over the PCR false positives rate. You see, the second wave did come, and his strong claims came to nothing.

I personally think the PCR false positive problem is a scandal, esp. since most of the errors are down to naive misinterpretation of results, or just bad sample handling. It's a real scandal, it has caused immense damage to the effort to save lives and scientists have fundamentally failed to fix that mass test programme, OK! So you're right , PCR mass testing is botched, but there is still a real problem with the Corona Virus killing many of the senior citizens. Yes, much of the data is bad, but even accounting for that, you will find there is still a big problem. So that's the bottom line, there's no reason to trust me, but I'm doing the best I can to let you know.

miahoneybee
Posts: 1050
Joined: Tue Sep 22, 2020 8:26 pm

Re: Vaccination

Post by miahoneybee »

Follow the money...uncover the lies...the narrative changed from protection to lessening the symptoms....buying food..having a holiday.. visiting leisure facilities.. living life might be reliant on having an experimental vaccine..that's called bullying..blackmail and coersion....

miahoneybee
Posts: 1050
Joined: Tue Sep 22, 2020 8:26 pm

Re: Vaccination

Post by miahoneybee »

https://youtu.be/uX4ty59v5qE

Again follow the money....

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