Strong encouragement of mask use is a proportionate intervention

NeilW
Posts: 24
Joined: Fri Aug 14, 2020 7:07 am

Re: Strong encouragement of mask use is a proportionate intervention

Post by NeilW »

Boethius wrote: Sat Aug 15, 2020 5:01 pm
However I also recognise the point that the wearing of facemasks is pretty pointless from an individual perspective
It makes sense for an individual in a high risk environment - like a hospital or a doctor's surgery. It protects others from you.

However it makes no sense to say "wear to protect the vulnerable". The vulnerable and the hysterical can protect themselves by staying out of harm's way. That way the cost of the measure is borne by those requiring it - not by everybody else.

We can help that by stopping forcing the vulnerable to move about. We should look at reducing the state pension age to 60 and perhaps even lower.

That does two things. Keeps demand up and replaced the furlough scheme and frees up jobs for younger people who are finding themselves out of work.

We should not be placing the cost on the healthy. We need them working, and producing if we are to support those at risk.

SiB
Posts: 1
Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2020 10:02 am

Re: Strong encouragement of mask use is a proportionate intervention

Post by SiB »

Something that seems to be getting missed in the mask debate is people's behaviour in the real world. Just watch people with masks on in supermarkets. Prior to entering they take hold of the thing that's been mopping up their breath to put it on, hence in many cases making their hands as potentially virus laden as possible. Many will continue to top this up during their shopping trip. The same can be said fir people about to get on buses - touch mask, touch face, touch pole everyone else touches.

I actually think that getting an hour's worth of CCTV footage from a supermarket, then editing it to show how much spread masks are likely creating could be enough to end the debate and rulings.

kernowequestrian
Posts: 2
Joined: Thu Aug 13, 2020 7:32 pm

Re: Strong encouragement of mask use is a proportionate intervention

Post by kernowequestrian »

Since the enlightenment and the end of christendom, our western/anglo culture has been and is fundamentally built on the sovereignty of the individual. English speaking governments tell you what you can't do, not what you can. We don't judge people by their relatives or as part of a collective. We don't tolerate strongmen and dictators. All of our morality and all of our art and culture doesn't stem from christian thought, it stems from our individual-first morality.

Maybe other cultures who are more communal and more accepting of being told what to do are, ultimately, better. Maybe China and Japan will thrive long after we disappear into the dirt. But there are very, very good reasons to not want our culture to be like either of those countries - I cannot think of a single (pre-covid) face-covering country that I'd want to live in. Even Japan, while not an authoritarian hellhole like China or Iran, is a fundamentally lonely and isolating society where a great many of the young famously don't mingle, don't love and don't breed.

The timing of the masks, after deaths and hospitalisations had vanished; and the rhetoric, comparing them to seatbelts, show us that this is not a temporary measure. I'd love to be wrong - I'd buy a mask and start wearing it this afternoon if Boris gave an end-date or an achievable win-condition upon achievement of which masks will be discarded. But this seems to me a permanent cultural change, being smuggled in under the guise of an emergency measure, using people's fear, paranoia and rapidly growing misanthropy to rapidly normalise this in the culture. We have a right to question and resist major changes to the fundamentals of our culture. We'll lose, we've already lost. But the "don't question it, just play along" mindset couldn't be more out of place here.

joshuag
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Aug 09, 2020 5:48 pm

Re: Strong encouragement of mask use is a proportionate intervention

Post by joshuag »

Honestly I've had it with this mask-wearing dictatorship! What are they gonna ask us to do next? Wear blindfolds? Wear helmets? Wear socks on our arms? They say it's to stop people dying but I have not seen a single person die! Not one!! My friend who's a homeopath says that masks do not help anyone :x :x

kate
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2020 1:59 pm

Re: Strong encouragement of mask use is a proportionate intervention

Post by kate »

I too am concerned by the "cultural change" We are not chinese and have a totally separate cultural trajectory. I have never worn a mask and yet - I find myself now accepting all these masked faces around me. How quickly does one become habituated to this? Soon I will find my maskless face strange.
What the hell is going on?

tom171uk
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2020 7:24 am

Re: Strong encouragement of mask use is a proportionate intervention

Post by tom171uk »

"Strong encouragement of mask use is a proportionate intervention"

I cannot see how it could possibly be considered proportionate. There is no empirical evidence to support its efficacy; it was not deemed appropriate when the infection rate was high; it has come in on the back of some bizarre, hysterical international groupthink, with the WHO being pressured by politicians to change its advice.

Indeed, it is the international groupthink that is most sinister.

clivepinder
Posts: 10
Joined: Sat May 09, 2020 8:15 pm
Location: California, England, Zanzibar
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Re: Strong encouragement of mask use is a proportionate intervention

Post by clivepinder »

I share your thoughts on this. I wrote a piece on this recently which you might find relevant and supportive. https://www.insearchofsanity.org/blogs/ ... -to-die-on

MsAnthropic
Posts: 3
Joined: Mon Aug 17, 2020 4:09 am

Re: Strong encouragement of mask use is a proportionate intervention

Post by MsAnthropic »

I’d be totally ok with “strong encouragement” of mask use, no problem. I’m currently in Melbourne Australia where I’ll be fined if I don’t wear a mask EVERYWHERE I GO. Big difference between encouragement and making it mandatory.

IamRipe
Posts: 148
Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2020 8:21 am

Re: Strong encouragement of mask use is a proportionate intervention

Post by IamRipe »

Something I haven't seen here mentioned and it is crucial piece of evidence. If you read about surgical face masks as a ppe, you will find out that these surgical masks protect you from everything bigger than 30 micro meters.
Every single virus is as big as 1 micro meter. So you actually can get 30 different viruses through 1 single spore on these surgical masks.
If you don't want to wear it, you doesn't have to. Just say at the shop entrance, that you're exempt from wearing one and that's it. Most of times, there is nobody to ask you why you not have one.

dm57
Posts: 19
Joined: Sun Aug 16, 2020 6:21 pm

Re: Strong encouragement of mask use is a proportionate intervention

Post by dm57 »

Face masks are worn in the far east against the poor air quality due to emissions.
Operating theatres I believe have an increased oxygen level to counteract the effect of face masks on the reduced level of oxygen due to face masks.
I did not want to get in to anybodies personal space before lockdown and willingly give people their space.
I drive 200 miles a day for work and feel more likely to die from a road traffic accident than covid 19 but I understand the risk and take the necessary measures to lessen these risks.
I do not wear a face mask as I get a feeling of what can only be described as what claustrophobia must be like. Was challenged early on but now no one says anything and am seeing more people not wearing them in stores.
What really troubles me is the number of young children I see wearing them as some sort of fashion item.

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